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A A AHi fellow landlords,
Over the last few years I have increased the size of my portfolio and statistically some time or the other I may get a tenant default. So over the last year as a matter of practice not only do I fully reference the prospective tenants using an accredited agency (which I've always done) but I make it a point to get RGI as standard practice now. There are very few providers that actually provide a good policy that covers all possible points / scenarios. I have spoken to companies like RentGuard, L&C, etc and have existing policies with both.
I have read a few negative reviews on this forum for RentGuard's policies for buildings insurance where it seems landlords have had a difficult time getting a claim to stick in case of storm damage, etc. etc. What I wanted to know is if any landlords have actually had to make a claim on the rental guarantee part. Did the likes of RentGuard actually cover the full monthly rent (upon tenant's default)? Did they start eviction proceedings, deal with the court, and finally get the tenant evicted? Or did the RGI providers somehow find a way to dispute the claim and just drag their feet.
I want to know if buying RGI across all my properties is actually worth the money? or is it just false peace of mind.. as when the unfortunate time came to claim, I'll just be on my own and should have saved myself the premium instead.
Would really like to hear others experiences.
Regards.
I am going through a situation presently which will be of great interest to you as it will answer directly your queries when the claim is concluded, hopefully successfully!!?
When you think that RGI can cost as little as £7.42 per month per property but could provide cover for up to £50000 including legal expenses per claim, that is peanuts.
So let's say you have 50 properties with RGI on them all.
That is £371 pm for coverage of up to £2500000 in extremis including legal costs.
47% of tenants are apparently in arrears,
It can take 10 months or more to evict a tenant.
Let's say the rent is £1000 pcm and it takes 10 months to evict all the tenants from the 50 properties.
That is £500000 of rent losses.
Plus the legal costs
Plus loss of the properties to repossession
Bankruptcy and loss of livelihood and homelessness.
All for the sake of £371 pcm which is offsettable against tax.
Referencing which does not qualify for RGI is useless which is why LA referencing is useless unless it is qualified by the RGI company as acceptable, but of course we have the thorny question of whether the LL will see and have access to all the referencing details!
If they don't then a LA reference is useless for the LL if he wants RGI.
Would you wish to take a massive risk for the sake of such a small amount of money?
The RGI I use accepts the referencing that the broker carries out.
This is in the insurance conditions.
So I have a supposed guarantee that NO further referencing is required.
Remember £600000 of rental income per year which costs £4452.00 to protect is peanuts.
Remember home owning guarantors are useless unless they qualify for the RGI policy.
Having a guarantor is no indication that they have no other debts or that the property is in negative equity and may fall in value further.
They could lose a job and be on state benefits.
Just to give you an example which is to my knowledge.
A former tenant of mine who was OK needed a guarantor.
The guarantor used was a tenant of mine who was also an associate of the former tenant.
The guarantor was in full time employment and paying my rent on time.
The guarantor was accepted by the LA; the one that advertises heavily on property tribes.
This guarantor stopped paying rent 5 months ago and was either sacked or resigned from her job 5 months ago.
So what happens if the former tenant defaults on rent and the LA comes to the guarantor for payment!!!?
Simple she is on the social and hasn't got a bean to her name.
As a guarantor therefore she is useless.
So you see RGI is the only way things will work properly, the rest is rubbish, it means nothing.
A RGI policy, however, CANNOT be disputed.
It is there to be claimed on and is the ONLY way of as near as dammit to guarantee you don't end up out of pocket for rental arrears.
Lot's of LL say they carry out all sorts of due diligence and the extreme circumstances I have quoted will never happen and they have sufficient resouces to cover rent losses whilst evicting a tenant.
47 % of tenants are in arrears.
Surely that concentrates any LL mind, no matter how good they think their referencing is!?
LRS should of course always be used in conjunction with RGI use.
I believe the economy is going to worsen, there will be a massive impact with UC being introduced and I think LL need to start laying plans to have tenants that qualify for RGI and get rid of those that don't, RGI can be obtained on incumbent tenants.
Remember with most RGI policies once they have been checked there is no requirement for the tenant to be checked again if the policy is renewed.
This is very useful if a tenant's circumstances change and they cannot meet their rent from normal sources but do so from a myriad of assistance; like LHA/UC; parents, friends etc.
Providing the contractual rent is paid then the RGI policy still stands.
Hi Slick,
It is a simple question of taking a gamble and the odds related to that gamble. It is like any insurance it is only worth it when you need to claim but if you have a problem and don't have it then as Paul B says your losses can be immense.
I always say smaller landlords with up to 3/4 property's should always have it because it is harder to spread a hit.
I do my RGI with rentguard who are affiliates, they also carry out my credit referencing to make sure I am underwritten properly in the event of a claim and have never had a problem, we also affiliated with Ensliegh and both companies are equally as good (and using them keeps the landlord Referencing website and lifestyle referencing free).
Take a look at our affiliates Rent Guarantee & Credit referencing and let me know what you think we are increasing the store so if you don't use them and find someone that you think we should approach then email me and let me know know. we want to offer our members the best that there is out there.
Follow me on twitter Paul_Rout
Paul R is there anything on this site which actually goes through the process that would be required.
I suppose I am thinking of a situation where the tenant says yes I'll take the property and I say, not until you have passed an RGI check.
Do your 2 affiliates have a process which can be managed to obtain an answer either way for a tenant or a guarantor.
An answer within say 45 mins is useful to a LL rather than days of forms etc.
Having a clearly explained process for these 2 RGI companies would be useful for LL looking at possibly obtaining RGI for the first time and perhaps not appreciating the nuances of certain RGI policies.
Many LL arene't even aware of RGI.
For the price for say 4 properties it can be so cheap as to be considered a gamble in addition to normal referencing.
If it pays out yoyu are quids in and if it fails you are only in the same position as if you hadn't bothered with a RGI policy.
For about £99 I think it is worth the gamble of taking out a RGI policy.
It is so little to lose if it doesn't work; but with so much to gain if it does!
The proverbial no-brainer for the little LL who cannot cover things from other rentals from larger portfolios that other LL have.
Hi Paul,
Yes they offer most permutations 6 and 12 months, Credit referencing, and all the usual trimmings. They do allow you to take out policies based on quick report and will pay out on them "But" I always take out the comprehensive report which is more thorough and gives an "Accept" and I always do my lifestyle referencing with us before I take them for my own piece of mind.
Just because you are insured it does not mean a bad tenant and the subsequent eviction does not take its toll on a landlord emotionally if not financially. So I make sure they are 100% before they move in and if that takes a few more days sobeit.
Better safe than sorry.
Rent Guarantee & Credit Referencing @ landlordreferencing.co.uk
Hi fellow landlords,
Thanks for your responses. I don't dispute the wisdom in taking out RGI. I have already taken it out on 2 of my properties when new tenants moved in and will be doing so for all the others as new tenancies are put in place.
I use an approved company for doing all the referencing etc. All I wanted to find out is about other LLs experience with these companies when they have actually had to make a claim. I know in the first response to my post, Paul Barrett has mentioned that he is the process of going through one. Hopefully Paul - you'll keep me posted. I just wanted to know how quickly they approve it (or give a difficult time to LLs for agreeing to the claim) and onto how prompt they are with starting eviction proceedings, etc. etc.
So, any other LLs out there who've actually been through the claims process on an RGI?
Regards.
Keep us informed of the issues Paul, it'll definitely be a huge factor in whether a lot of us decide to take out the insurance . . . It all sounds very good in principle.
Follow me on twitter @cpglettings
Follow me on twitter @CPGLettings
Good news the RGI claim has now been validated; I will be receiving £5000 in my bank account for rent arrears and £1000 on a monthly basis until eviction occurs.
Today this tenant advises she will be gone this week.
Which is damn annoying as I have just done a CCJ on her and I could have had her goods off her.
I really want ther to stay as the lovely RGI money will be rolling in for months.
RGI is the ONLY way to avoid being stitched up by wrongun tenants.
Honourable tenants would surrender their tenancy as soon as they they knew they couldn't pay rent.
How many honourable tenants do you know!!??
Quite frankly if you do not have RGI or can't get it on your tenant or a guarantor and cannot afford to cover losses of about 9 months rent and damages and theft per tenancy then you need to get out of this game.
RGI is the ONLY way to guarantee that you can pay your mortgage whilst you are evicting a tenant.
Of course this site is introducing RGI in conjunction with lifestyle referencing.
A LL would be MAD not to use these services as they are so cheap for the value you would receive should a claim ever have to be made.
Therefore any small investor can really only really consider tenants who would pass the RGI check.
This means NOT catering to the LHA market unless you wish to take massive risks.
So it is really a striaght choice
With decent tenants on whom you can obtain RGI then no problems with needing large funds to cover rent arrears etc
With tenants or their guarantor who don't pass the RGI check then you the LL will have to accept risking losing about £10000 per tenancy in the event you have to evict that tenant.
As a consequence of problems evicting LL will continue to withdraw from the LHA market as the risks are just too great.
Obviously for big LL they can cover arrears from cashflow and their practices of DD are such that they suffer few losses.
Little LL are NOT in a position to absorb such losses and so we have little alternative than to ensure our tenants would qualify for RGI.
This is the principal issue to concern yourself with when you enter this lettings market; principally,
Can you cover losses caused by a tenant and if no then you must have RGI on your tenant?
This means that you will be inevitably renting to a better class of tenant.
Until the law changes to facilitate immediate eviction of a tenant who has not paid rent small LL will have little alternative than to rent to, let us a say higher net worth individuals..
Basically because we have little choice unless we wish to risk our financial future on 1 wrongun LHA claimant.
NOT ME THANKYOU!
Thanks Paul for keeping us posted. Glad to know it is good news for you and that you won't be that much out of pocket. Well done
Which company was this? Was it rentguard you used? Any tips for us LLs when making a claim? What items did they ask for / check before validating your claim - I ask this because earlier you had said things were not going smoothly....
Thanks again.
Yes it was a glitch really; but I was presupposing it was going to run very smoothly and it would of done if the RGI company claims handler did the job properly.
I would hasten to add it it nothing to to with set up that LRS has just brought out.
Let me wait until the claim is concluded and she is out and then I think there might be some useful points as far as the company I have used.
It is possible the LRS set up is considered a better proposition and certainly I am not comparing.
I also don't think it is necessarily appropriate that one should discusss competition to the LRS product as we do need to keep LRS FREE at point of use.
I certainly think I will give the LRS offering a try when I next obtain a RGI policy.
The one I used was probably the biggest supplier of RGI in the UK.
Of course that does not mean they are the best!
I certainly think the price point offering by LRS is something that every LL should use.
You never know the tenant or guarantor might qualify; its worth paying the very small fee to find out and you can always charge the tenant before you do it.
Can't see many prospective tenants baulking at a charge 5 quid!!!!?
Even if they don't pass, you might still be taking them on as you would normally have done.
I think if LL would take on a tenant as per their normal checks and can also get the bonus of RGI qualification if they pass the checks you have done as much as any LL could hope for.
Personally I can't see how they can do it so cheaply; and I think it is important that more LL attempt to obtain a RGI policy on their existing or prospective tenant; especially if they are a very small LL like me who cannot absorb such losses of one tenant not paying rent until evicted, which as we all know from posts on this site can take months to years>
Apparently arrears are increasing at an exponential rate and if we as LL wish to preserve our sanity and sleep easy at night it is becoming an imperative to have RGI in place on our tenants.
Believe me I don't have a spare £5000 in my back pocket to cover the rent the tenant has not paid.
I would conjecture that I am NOT the only small LL in such a position!!!?
Taking into account the govt is unlikely to speed up the eviction process in case of non-payment of rent, the only way we LL can have a last chance saloon recovery of unpaid rent is via RGI.
And we haven't even got to UC being rolled out.
What efect do you think that will have on your rental income!!!??
I would be very concerned to say the least if I had any LHA claimants who will need to be on UC when it is gradually rolled out.
I have an awful feeling that the losses that LRS are reporting on just a 30000 database will be increasing rapidlyt over the coming years as the economy gets even worse.
There are to be 10 billion of welfare cuts coming soon!!No govt or councils will ever protect a LL from the legal system which allows a tenant to remain rent free in a property until evicted, which as we all know can take a long time.
RGI is the best last ditch defence we have against these tenants.
RGI should be the FIRST qualifying criteria that a LL considers when taking on a possible tenant.
Most LA checks are useless; far better to use the LRS service, then you've got all bases covered.
Just a quick question Paul, can you get RGI once a tenancy has commenced.
I have various long standing tenants however, I am conscious that welfare cuts will bite many tenants sooner rather than later and just want to be prepared with RGI.
Yes you can; but it takes a month notice before the policy will work.
This should be no problem unless your tenants state they are now redundant 1 week from now.
So get in the application NOW, so when and if it happens you willl be covered.
I know my RGI company I used does it, not sure about Rentguard etc.
If you have no joy with Rentguard give me a shout and I'll tell you who I used.
I enter this conversation from another angle: as a insurance broker I commend Rentguard and other RGI providers who offer to transfer the risk from the LL to Insurers for a premium, however there are lots of LL that feel that RGI is too costly or " it wont happen". Of course we all know the economy is not great , today 2000 employees at JJB were made redundant and they are not alone.
UC will be with us in 12 months then the safety net of welfare paying the rent will reduce as rents won't be paid for property that offers more bedrooms than a tenant needs and tenants who are unable to work or are made redundant will find themselves evicted if they cannot make up the rent from savings and so the problem gets bigger, RGI claims increase, the insurance market hardens, premiums increase and more LL find RGI is an expensive option.
So what to do ?
Minimise risk by asking new working tenants " how will you pay the rent if you are unable to work?" then suggest they arrange ASU and THEY can claim the full cost of rent from their own insurance , iits not expensive and better than eviction If you can afford a the cost of a takeaway each week that's about the cost of ASU for the average tenant and the LL does not pay the premium - but they do benefit as the tenant is protected.
Tenants concerned about job loss and losing their homes would probably thank the LL for raising the issue, I did with my last tenant and guess what.... he has just lost his job.
LL do yourself a favour and check out ASU.
Rentplan
RGI is dirt cheap at present; though I take your point that RGI premiums may harden in light of claims experience; it is NOT expensive presently unless you CHOOSE to use an expensive provider like H—let who provide the RGI to most LA, which says it all.
I can obtain RGI for £7.72 per month , that is NOT expensive.
However your plan is definitely of merit and fills a position where a tenant can't pass RGI checks.
There are millions of tenants who cannot obtain RGI and most LL would prefer to have some sort of cover on their tenants.
Rental arrears are increasing exponentially and will get worse over the coming years.
With eviction so difficult to achieve within the present legal system LL face massive losses if they do not protect the rent income.
Mortgages need paying; no rent, no mortgage payments, followed by repossession and loss of own home and homelessness.
All caused by 1 non-rent paying tenant.
Not having a rent protection policy in place on a tenant means a LL is on a knife-edge!
Rent protection is really only needed by small LL as large ones can cover their arrears out of their large profits.
They offset those losses against tax.
Small LL can offset such losses aswell but it is academic if the property has been repossessed due to the mortgage not being paid!
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